Talk:Pharisees

Karaite Judaism

The last section is pretty much copy and pasted from a sectarian Karaite website. It should either be deleted or opinions should be offered about how Rabbinic Jews see Karaites. Allow me to share some of these views: Karaites are anti-intellectual wannabee Sadducees who while incorporating older traditions are not Sadducees and were established long after said Sadducees were dead. The reasons for this are firstly because there Biblical canon is to my knowledge exactly the same as ours and we Rabbinic Jews find this odd because we would assume that they would use at least some of the Apocrypha in making there decisions even if they are not the direct word of G-d (a Karaite can correct this assumption if they like). Secondly if G-d had put all of the minutia of instructions regarding laws in Bible then we wouldn't have this problem but the Bible would be unwieldy he gave the minutia to humans to pass down and that is what he did. The Karaites do the same as it is impossible to interpret Deuteronomy 12:21 any other way (though they try to). In any case you could add these rebuttals to the bottom of the page, or get rid of the Karaite criticism section all together since this is not a forum that should be used for arguing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.202.217.173 (talk) 21:01, 2014 November 7 (UTC)

Sources: Second Paragraph; 1 and 2 Maccabees, two deuterocanonical books .....

To whoever wrote this section, many thanks for contributing your knowledge. In this paragraph, the reason for mentioning Maccabees and its theology is unclear. Is important to the narrative because the Pharisees derived some of their beliefs from these works? SkaryCarrot (talk) 03:50, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Comparison section

The comparison section is sourced to the Jewish Virtual Library and appears to be a rather direct copy/paste job. Furthermore, according to Perennial sources the JVL is generally considered unreliable. As such I'm going to cut this section. I'm gonna leave this comment over at Essenes and Sadducees too. IrishStephen (talk) 00:34, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

Links between Rabbinic Judaism and Pharisees

The article takes the view that the Rabbis are the continuation of the Pharisees while this is not a fact and many academic authorities say the opposite (Prof Seth Schwartz or Martin Goodman). They and others explain that these were two different groups with different ideologies, the Rabbis being originally a fringe movement with no influence, while the Pharisees were a very popular movement. The Pharisees did not believe or as far as we know were even aware of the existence of a Oral Torah, which seems to have been the specific creed of the Rabbis. The Mishna itself refers to the Pharisees as a different group. The article needs to be edited to reflect at least the plurality of academic opinions. 2A02:ED0:538E:100:21ED:4828:D2A9:403E (talk) 17:43, 25 April 2024 (UTC)

Rabbinic Judaism is absolutely a direct descendent of the pharisees, by the pharisaic diaspora expelled by Rome. This is historically documented.

Jews are proud of their pharisee descent. ~2026-94288-0 (talk) 18:31, 11 February 2026 (UTC)

What is historically documented ? Do you have any source ? Scholars explain that the Pharisees were a different movement from the Rabbis. The Rabbis were probably originally a elite group inside the Pharisees but at some point they diverged. The Talmud itself speaks of the Pharisees as another sect. ~2026-33103-43 (talk) 08:42, 4 June 2026 (UTC)

Turning to the Gentiles

A subtle (maybe moot) point, but the statement from Romans 11:25 cannot be used to make the contextual claim that Pharisaism and Christianity competed after 70 AD, but Jews did not heed the message, so the apostles turned to the Gentiles, as Romans is dated before the destruction of the Temple. Furthermore, the reason the apostles turned to the Gentiles is because of Jewish rejection in Antioch (Pisidia) recorded in Acts 13:46. 128.54.75.48 (talk) 19:47, 15 May 2025 (UTC) 128.54.75.48 (talk) 19:47, 15 May 2025 (UTC)

References

Conflating Jew and Israelite

Israelites or Hebrews are a set of tribes that settled current palestine during the Iron age. Jews are descendents of one ancient kingdom formed by one of these tribes: Judea. Conflating Israelite or Hebrew and Jew is a dangerous mistake that encourages one specific narrative. while denying the identity of the people of Palestine. ~2026-94288-0 (talk) 18:35, 11 February 2026 (UTC)

Jews are Israelites. The only other group claiming to be Israelites are the 900 Samaritans. The muslims and christians do not claim to be Israelites or even being descendants of Israelites (while this is probably the case for part of them, we have documentation in particular for the mass conversion of the Samaritans), sometimes they claim to descend from the Canaanites, sometimes from the Arab tribes, or some other claim. ~2026-33103-43 (talk) 08:39, 4 June 2026 (UTC)